Glossary entry (derived from question below)
Apr 25, 2023 16:46
1 yr ago
31 viewers *
French term
trèfle
French to English
Tech/Engineering
Engineering (general)
In a contract about laying a pipeline, a party is required to insert "fourreaux de cables PEHD" into the steel piping.
Party then agrees that it shall "mettre en place un dispositif de protection de l’extrémité du fourreau acier par laquelle est introduit le trèfle de tubes PEHD".
I can't figure out what the trèfle is. Any help much appreciated.
Party then agrees that it shall "mettre en place un dispositif de protection de l’extrémité du fourreau acier par laquelle est introduit le trèfle de tubes PEHD".
I can't figure out what the trèfle is. Any help much appreciated.
Proposed translations
+1
5 hrs
Selected
(HDPE ducts in) trefoil formation
'Trefoil' refers to the layout of three conductors running parallel to each other (as opposed to 'triplex' formation where the cables are twisted together).
"Trefoil Formation refers to a method of arranging cables. The trefoil arrangement is primarily used in situations where the three phases are carried by individual cables rather than a single three phase cable. [ … ] Connecting the individual cables in the trefoil formation minimizes the magnetic field around the conductor and reduces the heating. There are special trefoil spacers which hold individual cables in place so that the magnetic fields cancel each other to the maximum."
https://www.hellermanntyton.co.uk/binaries/content/assets/lo...
Your question, however, addresses not cables but the trefoil formation of HDPE ducts (which contain an unspecified number and layout of cables).
"The proposed underground cable sections will comprise three 33kV cables per circuit installed in a trench in a trefoil duct formation, as illustrated in Diagram 4.2: Typical Underground Cable Trench in this chapter"
https://docs.planning.org.uk/20220801/231/RFSDP7NT0BQ00/sa1e...
"Trench cross section of a 110 kV single circuit trefoil duct formation"
https://www.eirgridgroup.com/site-files/library/EirGrid/Cult...
These examples concern ducts laid in trefoil formation in trenches, i.e. surrounded by earth, not enclosed in a larger duct. I have not actually found any reference with trefoil ducts in steel pipe, but your text seems to be saying this is done. I have found only reference to trefoil cable installation in steel pipe.
As for the protection element, might it be a sort of perforated end plate allowing the ducts in trefoil formation to be drawn into the steel pipe but prohibiting the access of any foreign objects (you know how construction workers lose their hammers, when they're not losing their jeans, that is)?
Unless it is some arrangement whereby the plastic ducts are prevented from snagging (with resultant damage) on the sharp (?) edges of the steel pipe. I think there are various roller and funnel arrangements for achieving this.
Another issue is the time at which this protection is applied. Is it clear that it is during the 'duct pulling' operation, when hammer loss and duct damage need be prevented, or is the protection (sealant) applied around the ducts, at the end (both ends, presumbly?) once they are in place, "to prevent the ingress of water and gas"?
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Note added at 22 hrs (2023-04-26 15:04:59 GMT)
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I suspect 'pipeline', which might be said in French for a steel tube enclosing multiple cables (or ducts, themselves containing cables, something for which, though I do not exclude the possibity, we do not seem to have found any evidence thus far), is a misnomer for what I find named pipe-type cable systems, though these all appear to involve cables (albeit possibly with HDPE external sheaths) rather than ducts.
https://www.okonite.com/media/catalog/product/files/Pipe-Typ...
Or other combinations with 'pipe-type' such as high-pressure, fluid-filled (HPFF) pipe-type cable
"A high-pressure, fluid-filled (HPFF) pipe-type of underground transmission line, consists of a steel pipe that contains three high-voltage conductors. Each conductor is made of copper or aluminum; insulated with high-quality, oil-impregnated kraft paper insulation; and covered with metal shielding (usually lead) and skid wires (for protection during construction)."
https://electrical-engineering-portal.com/understanding-unde...
In pipe-type systems, the cables are surrounded by a gas or liquid dielectric. Putting cables in ducts inside the pipe would sort of defeat the purpose, unless the ducts too are filled with the same dielectric.
For under-track crossings, however (as opposed to long 'pipelines'), we do find ducts (UPVC) inside steel pipe (see image from https://extranet.artc.com.au/docs/eng/electrical/procedures/...
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Note added at 22 hrs (2023-04-26 15:05:41 GMT)
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"Trefoil Formation refers to a method of arranging cables. The trefoil arrangement is primarily used in situations where the three phases are carried by individual cables rather than a single three phase cable. [ … ] Connecting the individual cables in the trefoil formation minimizes the magnetic field around the conductor and reduces the heating. There are special trefoil spacers which hold individual cables in place so that the magnetic fields cancel each other to the maximum."
https://www.hellermanntyton.co.uk/binaries/content/assets/lo...
Your question, however, addresses not cables but the trefoil formation of HDPE ducts (which contain an unspecified number and layout of cables).
"The proposed underground cable sections will comprise three 33kV cables per circuit installed in a trench in a trefoil duct formation, as illustrated in Diagram 4.2: Typical Underground Cable Trench in this chapter"
https://docs.planning.org.uk/20220801/231/RFSDP7NT0BQ00/sa1e...
"Trench cross section of a 110 kV single circuit trefoil duct formation"
https://www.eirgridgroup.com/site-files/library/EirGrid/Cult...
These examples concern ducts laid in trefoil formation in trenches, i.e. surrounded by earth, not enclosed in a larger duct. I have not actually found any reference with trefoil ducts in steel pipe, but your text seems to be saying this is done. I have found only reference to trefoil cable installation in steel pipe.
As for the protection element, might it be a sort of perforated end plate allowing the ducts in trefoil formation to be drawn into the steel pipe but prohibiting the access of any foreign objects (you know how construction workers lose their hammers, when they're not losing their jeans, that is)?
Unless it is some arrangement whereby the plastic ducts are prevented from snagging (with resultant damage) on the sharp (?) edges of the steel pipe. I think there are various roller and funnel arrangements for achieving this.
Another issue is the time at which this protection is applied. Is it clear that it is during the 'duct pulling' operation, when hammer loss and duct damage need be prevented, or is the protection (sealant) applied around the ducts, at the end (both ends, presumbly?) once they are in place, "to prevent the ingress of water and gas"?
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 22 hrs (2023-04-26 15:04:59 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
I suspect 'pipeline', which might be said in French for a steel tube enclosing multiple cables (or ducts, themselves containing cables, something for which, though I do not exclude the possibity, we do not seem to have found any evidence thus far), is a misnomer for what I find named pipe-type cable systems, though these all appear to involve cables (albeit possibly with HDPE external sheaths) rather than ducts.
https://www.okonite.com/media/catalog/product/files/Pipe-Typ...
Or other combinations with 'pipe-type' such as high-pressure, fluid-filled (HPFF) pipe-type cable
"A high-pressure, fluid-filled (HPFF) pipe-type of underground transmission line, consists of a steel pipe that contains three high-voltage conductors. Each conductor is made of copper or aluminum; insulated with high-quality, oil-impregnated kraft paper insulation; and covered with metal shielding (usually lead) and skid wires (for protection during construction)."
https://electrical-engineering-portal.com/understanding-unde...
In pipe-type systems, the cables are surrounded by a gas or liquid dielectric. Putting cables in ducts inside the pipe would sort of defeat the purpose, unless the ducts too are filled with the same dielectric.
For under-track crossings, however (as opposed to long 'pipelines'), we do find ducts (UPVC) inside steel pipe (see image from https://extranet.artc.com.au/docs/eng/electrical/procedures/...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 22 hrs (2023-04-26 15:05:41 GMT)
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Note from asker:
| Thanks, especially for pointing out the difference between trefoil and triplex. There was no more technical detail about the procedure - indeed if it had got any more granular than this, I wouldn't have been the translator for the job. |
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Daryo
: by the time I posted my answer you already posted more or less the same one! // You forgot surgeons "forgetting" instruments and other bits in patients' bodies ...
37 mins
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For once it's not me posting the result of my research after somebody else has surreptitiously slipped in much the same answer ;-)
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| agree |
philgoddard
: Daryo is complaining that you posted the same answer first? Now I've heard everything...
5 hrs
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
+3
9 mins
Andrew Bramhall
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
Native in English
United Kingdom
Flair and accuracy tailored to your text
Native in: English 
Works in: Spanish to English, German to English
Cluster (pipe cluster/cluster of pipes)
"install a device to protect the end of the steel casing through which the HDPE pipe cluster is inserted".
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Tony M
: Yes, sounds like a triad of round pipes
2 mins
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Yep, thanks Tony!;
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| agree |
SafeTex
: I've explained why I think it's this in the discussion but i wouldn't stake my life on it either
4 hrs
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Thank you!
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| neutral |
Jennifer Levey
: This isn't an amorphous anonymous 'cluster' - at the very least the translation must include a clear allusion to the number '3'.
7 hrs
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Yep, thanks.
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| agree |
Ilian DAVIAUD
18 hrs
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multumesc!
|
3 hrs
Jennifer Levey
Chile
Chile
Native in English
Chile
Human-scale Globalization
Native in: English (Variant: British)
Works in: Spanish to English, French to English, English to Spanish, and 2 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
108
trefoil cable cleat
The ST says mettre en place un dispositif de protection de l’extrémité du fourreau acier par laquelle est introduit le trèfle de tubes PEHD. However, the tubes themselves are smooth both inside and outside, so the question is: 'what could damage the extrémité du fourreau acier?'
The answer is the trefoil cable cleats that are fitted to the tubes at regular intervals to ensure that they are properly aligned and maintain the required spacing between each tube and the inner surface of the fourreau. The cleats could easy get caught against the end of the fourreau as the tubes are inserted, with an attendant risk of damage to the fourreau, the cleats themselves - or both.
IOW, where the ST says trèfle, it almost certainly refers to the cleats, not the three tubes.
Further explanations and pix here:
https://www.powerandcables.com/product/product-category/tref...
"Trefoil cable formation according to IEC61914 is “the formation of three cables so laid to be mutually equidistant. Viewed in cross-section, the lines joining the cable centres form an equilaterial triangle.” The range of trefoil cable cleats distributed by Thorne & Derrick have been successfully tested and certified in accordance with IEC61914 – the cleat testing includes subjecting the trefoil cleats to extreme short circuit and electromagnetic force levels."
The answer is the trefoil cable cleats that are fitted to the tubes at regular intervals to ensure that they are properly aligned and maintain the required spacing between each tube and the inner surface of the fourreau. The cleats could easy get caught against the end of the fourreau as the tubes are inserted, with an attendant risk of damage to the fourreau, the cleats themselves - or both.
IOW, where the ST says trèfle, it almost certainly refers to the cleats, not the three tubes.
Further explanations and pix here:
https://www.powerandcables.com/product/product-category/tref...
"Trefoil cable formation according to IEC61914 is “the formation of three cables so laid to be mutually equidistant. Viewed in cross-section, the lines joining the cable centres form an equilaterial triangle.” The range of trefoil cable cleats distributed by Thorne & Derrick have been successfully tested and certified in accordance with IEC61914 – the cleat testing includes subjecting the trefoil cleats to extreme short circuit and electromagnetic force levels."
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Daryo
: trefoil - as the shape of the bundle: yes, but can't see any "cleat" in this text.
1 hr
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6 hrs
French term (edited):
le trèfle de tubes PEHD / le trèfle de fourreaux de câbles PEHD
the trifoil bundle of HDPE cable conduits / the trifoil formation of HDPE cable conduits
fourreaux de câbles PEHD = fourreaux en PEHD pour câbles
le trèfle = a bundle of 3 electrical conduits with a "trefoil" cross section
Single-Core Cables Laid in Trefoil or Flat Formations – Advantages & Disadvantages
...
https://www.etscablecomponents.com/blog/2013/11/single-core-...
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Note added at 6 hrs (2023-04-25 23:19:39 GMT)
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Putting cables in PEHD conduits and then the whole trifoil formation inside a steel tube might look like a overkill, but if this is going to run parallel to the pipeline in all sort of terrain, then that level of protection might well be needed.
le trèfle = a bundle of 3 electrical conduits with a "trefoil" cross section
Single-Core Cables Laid in Trefoil or Flat Formations – Advantages & Disadvantages
...
https://www.etscablecomponents.com/blog/2013/11/single-core-...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 6 hrs (2023-04-25 23:19:39 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Putting cables in PEHD conduits and then the whole trifoil formation inside a steel tube might look like a overkill, but if this is going to run parallel to the pipeline in all sort of terrain, then that level of protection might well be needed.
Discussion
Not a minor details: the shape of this bundle of High Density Poly Ethylene tubes (NOT cables) being "un trèfle" (NOT "flat" or "torsadée" or ...) that should be reflected in the translation. Just "bundle" is too vague.
@ Steve Robbie
The way you present the context of your ST is mildly puzzling/misleading. The whole project might well about laying a pipeline, but It would be strange to have this "trèfle de tubes PEHD" inside the actual pipeline. This "fourreau acier" wouldn't be the pipeline, but just a protection for this "trèfle de tubes PEHD", possibly running parallel to the pipeline?
It's very hard to decide between the two answers which are clearly on the same track
But my knowledge of French tells me that it is the actual cables with the trefoil (Andrew's answer)
I think that if it was a trefoil FOR cables, the preposition would be different - "trèfle À cable, rather than "trèfle de cables"
Think of the more familiar example of "tasse à café" v "tasse de café"
The trefoil and cables are probably assembled prior to insertion and therefore both the trefoil and cables are inserted together in any case, but this would be "trèfle de cables"
https://www.samarais.com/fr/produits/spiraleuse.html