Daryo Dec 16, 2018:

@ Eliza Hall Agree. Although "no one else is qualified" more accurately would be "no one else is authorised" - nowadays at least.

I remember reading years ago a very interesting article about the underhand ways French "notaires" managed to snub the other legal "tribes" and clinch this legal monopoly on conveyancing decades ago. (just a digression)

I realise now that my formulation was ambiguous.

When I said "who in his right mind would want such a person involved in any serious business involving real estate in France" I had in mind "any person who thinks that a French notaire is the same as a US notary, just because it's similarly sounding"

Eliza Hall Dec 15, 2018:

@ Daryo You asked, "who in his right mind would want such a person involved in any serious business involving real estate in France, what would then be an appropriate translation?"

In France you would want a notaire, and actually I think that's who you have to use for real estate -- no one else is qualified. But yes, you would never ever want a US notary anywhere near a real estate transaction, except if you needed someone's signature to be notarized (authenticated -- i.e. the notary checked the person's ID to confirm who they were, and then watched them sign).

So if the original text is talking about a notaire in a French real estate transaction, I would either translate it as "French real estate transaction attorney" (or real estate counsel, or something like that), or leave it in French, italicized, with the explanatory translation in parentheses.

If it's talking about notaires more generally, as Elizabeth's text may be, I would definitely use the italicized French word + explanation in parentheses approach for the first instance of the word, and then just italicized "notaires" for all later instances.

B D Finch Dec 15, 2018:

Notaries UK and US There is a problem, when translating for an international or undefined readership, in that a notary in England and Wales is a qualified professional, while a notary in the US is a (very slightly) glorified clerical worker.

Daryo Dec 14, 2018:

@ Eliza Hall OK - "notary" would be seriously misleading for someone in UK or US who hasn't got a clue about the French legal system.

Leaving aside a quite natural question to ask: who in his right mind would want such a person involved in any serious business involving real estate in France, what would then be an appropriate translation?

Tony M Dec 14, 2018:

@ Eliza And not just in the US either! The situation is not so very different in the UK, where a notary has a quite different role and does not deal with house conveyancing, for example.

Eliza Hall Dec 14, 2018:

Notaire does not mean notary In France a notaire is a type of lawyer. You can't become a notaire without a master's in law -- the same degree required to become a lawyer in France. You also have to do a two-year post-master's internship, take an exam (un concours), and swear an oath before the court. This is the same path every French lawyer follows, with differences due only to specialization (a future commercial litigator doesn't take the same concours or do the same internship as a future notaire). The same is true in the UK.

However, in the US a notary is just someone temporarily certified by the state to confirm the authenticity of signatures and of copied documents. That's all they can do. No post-high school education is required; some states don't even require a high school diploma.

Unless you're writing for a clearly and strictly British audience, it is a mistake to translate notaire by notary or vice-versa.

Compare:

Comment devenir notaire: https://www.lepetitjuriste.fr/conseils-et-orientation/commen...

How to become a notary in New York state:
https://www.dos.ny.gov/licensing/notary/notary.html

UK: https://www.frenchentree.com/french-property/law/notary-or-n...

elizabeth_med (asker) Dec 14, 2018:

France.

Tony M Dec 14, 2018:

@ Asker: Context? What country is this from? In France, there is a special secure account used with a different name, so it's important to know where this is from?