This question was closed without grading. Reason: No acceptable answer
Sep 2, 2017 11:22
6 yrs ago
3 viewers *
French term
Chacun des Partenaires, et XXX n’étant pas solidaires.
French to English
Law/Patents
Law: Contract(s)
This is a draft agreement between several partners and a company [XXX].
The list of the names of the various parties ends with the phrase:
Chacun des Partenaires, et XXX n’étant pas solidaires.
Does this simply mean 'the partners and XXX are not jointly liable'? Or is there more to it? (UK English btw)
Thanks in advance
Liz
The list of the names of the various parties ends with the phrase:
Chacun des Partenaires, et XXX n’étant pas solidaires.
Does this simply mean 'the partners and XXX are not jointly liable'? Or is there more to it? (UK English btw)
Thanks in advance
Liz
Proposed translations
(English)
Proposed translations
-3
8 hrs
Disclaimer: the agreement excludes mutual obligations between each partner and XXX
my take
Peer comment(s):
neutral |
writeaway
: your take based on what? Any refs or explanations?/a disclaimer? how do you know that?
1 hr
|
The sentence is a disclaimer attached to an agreement draft
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disagree |
AllegroTrans
: I see nothing indicating that this is a disclaimer and you have inserted words that are simply not there; asker says this follows the names of parties at the end of an agreement
2 hrs
|
disagree |
Daryo
: If there is no obligations between none of the partners and XXX, what's the contract about? Or more precisely what would be the point of a contract establishing no obligations whatsoever?
10 hrs
|
solidarity is not necessarily the goal of any contract
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disagree |
Germaine
: Tu as relu ça? Si "l'entente exclut les obligations mutuelles entre les Partners et XXX, plus personne n'a d'obligation envers l'autre, non? Donc, tout le monde peut faire/ne pas faire et personne n'a de recours. Y a-t-il un contrat?
2 days 21 hrs
|
42 mins
said partners being individually but not jointly obligated with respect to the company XXX
(Not that I have seen this before, but you have to arrive at a solution like this by a process of elimination of the other possible interpretations.)
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Note added at 20 hrs (2017-09-03 08:03:10 GMT)
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Alternative that I missed and that Daryo pointed out:
said partners and company XXX being individually but not jointly obligated with respect to YYY.
Alternative 2: said partners and company XXX being severally but not jointly obligated with respect to YYY.
("severally but not jointly" sounds odd but it is frequently found.)
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Note added at 20 hrs (2017-09-03 08:03:10 GMT)
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Alternative that I missed and that Daryo pointed out:
said partners and company XXX being individually but not jointly obligated with respect to YYY.
Alternative 2: said partners and company XXX being severally but not jointly obligated with respect to YYY.
("severally but not jointly" sounds odd but it is frequently found.)
Peer comment(s):
neutral |
AllegroTrans
: we don't know whether liability to the company is meant here, it could mean something else entirely
3 hrs
|
It goes without saying that the "liability" as you call it is liability (i.e. contractual obligations of any type) under the Contract. I have seen this use of unattributed "obligations" dozens if not hundreds of times.
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neutral |
Daryo
: YES BUT additional context confirmed what basic grammar would suggest - said partners AND "XXX" are all together as a group providing (research) services to some other YYY party. => they are all "non solidaires" in relation to some other YYY party
1 day 10 hrs
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Please see 2 other Alternatives that I already offered many hours ago in response to YOUR explanation in the Discussion well before your entry. Therefore, to some extent, your Neutral offering is Neutral in refutation of yourself.
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1 day 13 hrs
French term (edited):
Chacun des Partenaires Initiaux, et XXX n’étant pas solidaires
None of the Initial Partners nor XXX having any joint responsibility
None of the Initial Partners nor XXX having any joint responsibility ... towards the party financing this research ("Partenaire Industriel")
the Initial Partners and XXX are still "severally" responsible - [i.e. each for its own obligations], but that bit is not stated and can be left implied.
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Note added at 1 day13 hrs (2017-09-04 00:36:36 GMT)
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https://cours.unjf.fr/repository/coursefilearea/file.php/213...
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Note added at 1 day13 hrs (2017-09-04 00:39:05 GMT)
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there is NOTHING ODD in "severally but not jointly" responsible:
http://smallbusiness.chron.com/difference-between-jointly-li...
the Initial Partners and XXX are still "severally" responsible - [i.e. each for its own obligations], but that bit is not stated and can be left implied.
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Note added at 1 day13 hrs (2017-09-04 00:36:36 GMT)
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https://cours.unjf.fr/repository/coursefilearea/file.php/213...
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Note added at 1 day13 hrs (2017-09-04 00:39:05 GMT)
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there is NOTHING ODD in "severally but not jointly" responsible:
http://smallbusiness.chron.com/difference-between-jointly-li...
Peer comment(s):
neutral |
AllegroTrans
: do you not think this is about joint liabillity?
19 hrs
|
it is about the absence of joint liability, i.e. each participant in this research is responsible only for its own research and spending, not for how other partners in this research project are spending or misspending funds allocated to them.
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Discussion
This agreement made on...
Between:
A.... ; and
B.... ; and
C...
each severally but not jointly;
and :
Z...
Voir, par exemple:
www.viasat.com/sites/default/files/legacy/support/purchasin...
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/879496/0000857645060...
"... Initiaux ..."
which means implicitly that XXX is "a new Partner", i.e. by implication that XXX is part of the same group as "the partners", and that all of them together as a group are dealing with another party YYY.
By omitting "Initiaux" you made it very easy to fall into the trap of seeing XXX as not being one of the "Partners"!
The meaning of "Initiaux" on its own is plain and simple for sure, but the difference between
Chacun des Partenaires Initiaux, et XXX ....
and
Chacun des Partenaires, et XXX ....
is more than enough to send you down a blind alley ...
No Joint and Several Liability Sample Clauses
https://www.lawinsider.com › Clauses
No Joint and Several Liability. The obligations of the Sellers set forth in this Agreement are individual to each Seller and are not joint and several, and no liability ...
Obligations Not Joint and Several Clause Uses in Master Accounts ...
https://www.lawinsider.com › Master Accounts Receivable Purchase Agreement
... it is understood and agreed that the Obligations of each Seller under the Facility Documents to which such Seller is a party are not joint and several, such that ...
Partenariat ---
Entre les soussignés :
1 ---,
Etablissement Public à caractère Scientifique, Culturel et Professionnel
Sise ---
Représentée par sa Présidente, ---, dûment habilité aux fins des présentes,
Ci-après désignée "---",
agissant tant pour son compte qu’au nom et pour le compte de :
---,
Etablissement public à caractère scientifique et technologique,
sis ---,
représenté par son Président-Directeur général, ---
---,
Etablissement Public à caractère Administratif
sise ---,
représentée par son Directeur Général, ---.
---, [Société] à but non lucratif
---,
Établissement public de santé, sis ---
---,
Ci-après désignés collectivement les "Partenaires Initiaux",
2 ---, société anonyme au capital de ---Euros, dont le siège social est situé---, représentée par ---, Présidente du Directoire, dûment habilitée,
Ci-après désignée "XXX"
Chacun des Partenaires Initiaux, et XXX n’étant pas solidaires.
Et,
3 [La société],
[adresse], représentée par [nom] en sa qualité de [fonction]
Ci-après désigné le "Partenaire Industriel" ou « [La société] »
Les personnes ci-dessus sont ci-après désignées en
Chacun des Partenaires, et XXX ne sont pas solidaires.
it would imply that there is a another YYY party, and that all and each Partner and XXX together are severely BUT NOT jointly responsible for the fulfilment of some undefined "obligations" that they all have to YYY.
Trying to translate just a fraction of a sentence is bound to end up in tears / result in "car crash" translation ...
Some more context?