ProZ.com Translation Forums

Files in Pages format (Macintosh) | time consuming method

Sandu Coros-Leca — Wed, 07 Dec 2022 16:16:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Files in Pages format (Macintosh)
Poster: Sandu Coros-Leca
Post title: time consuming method

I export the Pages file into .pptx format.
After translation I Copy/Paste each translated string (manually) from PowerPoint into Pages and do the post-editing in Pages.
I know that is extended working time but it's more important to preserve the quality of the pictures, colours, etc.

Maybe your client(s) will appreciate the quality and can pay for it.

Files in Pages format (Macintosh) | RGB/CMYK

Joakim Braun — Wed, 30 Nov 2022 10:15:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Files in Pages format (Macintosh)
Poster: Joakim Braun
Post title: RGB/CMYK

I believe MS Word still doesn't support CMYK colors. So round-trip conversion will mangle CMYK.
If the document is intended for printing this is potentially a show-stopper.

If you're converting entire files between document formats (and not just importing the text into a CAT tool) you need to clear the conversion pathway with your customer.

Files in Pages format (Macintosh) | Loss of formatting caused by conversion to DOCX

CafeTran Trainer — Wed, 30 Nov 2022 09:52:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Files in Pages format (Macintosh)
Poster: CafeTran Trainer
Post title: Loss of formatting caused by conversion to DOCX

Files in Pages format (Macintosh) | This doesn't happen to me

Tom in London — Tue, 29 Nov 2022 15:33:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Files in Pages format (Macintosh)
Poster: Tom in London
Post title: This doesn't happen to me

[quote]María Luisa Barrera wrote:

Thanks for your comments. Everything helps.

It is not a good idea to convert to Word because it messes up the whole aspect of the document a lot and the client needs a translated Page.

At the moment the option is to save the text in Word, translate and re-import it to layout it again... It is what gives the best quality to the client and the best solution. [/quote]

Doesn't happen to me; I can create a file in Pages (version 11.1) and export it to Word and the difference is indistinguishable.

[Edited at 2022-11-29 15:34 GMT]

Files in Pages format (Macintosh)

María Luisa Barrera — Tue, 29 Nov 2022 13:19:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Files in Pages format (Macintosh)
Poster: María Luisa Barrera

Thanks for your comments. Everything helps.

It is not a good idea to convert to Word because it messes up the whole aspect of the document a lot and the client needs a translated Page.

At the moment the option is to save the text in Word, translate and re-import it to layout it again... It is what gives the best quality to the client and the best solution.

Files in Pages format (Macintosh) | From new Pages to an older version

CafeTran Trainer — Mon, 28 Nov 2022 19:17:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Files in Pages format (Macintosh)
Poster: CafeTran Trainer
Post title: From new Pages to an older version

I think that this will have the least loss of formatting.

If you need to deliver your translation in Pages format, I think this is your best option.

Ms Word files have a completely different structure. Same for OpenOffice and LibreOffice.

BTW: In which Pages version were the files created? Do you still have access to that version? How do you have to deliver the documents? Would pdf be acceptable?

[Edited at 2022-11-28 20:24 GMT]

Files in Pages format (Macintosh) | doc or docx

MollyRose — Mon, 28 Nov 2022 18:30:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Files in Pages format (Macintosh)
Poster: MollyRose
Post title: doc or docx

I am not arguing with you, Tom. Maybe it just depends on which version of Pages you have, whether or not it needs to be the older .doc. My version of Pages is quite old, so whenever I save something to Word to send to another computer, I have to save it as .doc in order to keep the formatting decent. I rarely use Pages anyway; I usually use OpenOffice. I welcome any comments.

Files in Pages format (Macintosh) | Export

Tom in London — Mon, 28 Nov 2022 16:55:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Files in Pages format (Macintosh)
Poster: Tom in London
Post title: Export

[quote]MollyRose wrote:

If Pages doesn't work with Trados, I would convert the Pages file to a .doc, which is compatible. [/quote]

Just export the Pages file as a Word document (making sure you save it as .docx, not .doc)

Files in Pages format (Macintosh) | CafeTran Espresso

CafeTran Trainer — Mon, 28 Nov 2022 16:30:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Files in Pages format (Macintosh)
Poster: CafeTran Trainer
Post title: CafeTran Espresso

Export the document to Pages '09.

Open in CafeTran Espresso (evaluation version will do).

Translate the XLIFF in Trados.

Files in Pages format (Macintosh) | convert to Word

MollyRose — Mon, 28 Nov 2022 16:13:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Files in Pages format (Macintosh)
Poster: MollyRose
Post title: convert to Word

If Pages doesn't work with Trados, I would convert the Pages file to a .doc, which is compatible.

Files in Pages format (Macintosh)

María Luisa Barrera — Mon, 28 Nov 2022 13:49:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Files in Pages format (Macintosh)
Poster: María Luisa Barrera

Does anyone know how to translate a Pages (Macintohs text editor) file in Trados?
We use a very expensive method, in case someone can help us to shorten the times with some tool or similar...
Thank you

Translating in ADOBE using ADOBE PRO | Try to get the very original files

Jorge Payan — Sat, 22 Oct 2022 15:31:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Translating in ADOBE using ADOBE PRO
Poster: Jorge Payan
Post title: Try to get the very original files

As other participants in this thread say, you can die several times while trying to edit in Acrobat. Open the file in Acrobat, go to File -> Properties, look at Advanced -> PDF producer (or alike, as my Acrobat DC is in Spanish) and you will find which program created the PDF file you have. I guess it should be AutoCad (dwf).

Ask your customer for the orginal files. I use [url removed] for translating the texts in the drawings.

Translating in ADOBE using ADOBE PRO | Infix or text boxes

Stepan Konev — Sat, 22 Oct 2022 12:51:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Translating in ADOBE using ADOBE PRO
Poster: Stepan Konev
Post title: Infix or text boxes

PDF is a secondary format. You can't create a new document directly in Adobe Acrobat. There is always a source file be it docx, dwg, jpeg or idml. Therefore, one way is to use the source file for translation. I guess it is dwg in your case.
Also, you can use a PDF editor like Infix or Foxit to add text boxes over the original text. However, using this app is hardly faster than Adobe Acrobat until you get hand in it.
[url= [url removed] ][img] [url removed] [/img][/url]
The simplest way (in my opinion, though still not simple) is to add textboxes directly in Adobe Acrobat with white background and transparent borders. Here is a [url= [url removed] ]short video[/url] of the workflow. It is in Russian, but probably you can catch the idea. Once you manage to create one text box with all desired properties (ink color, background, frame, etc.), then you can copy and paste the same box for every next translatable caption.

[Edited at 2022-10-22 19:49 GMT]

Translating in ADOBE using ADOBE PRO | What

Joakim Braun — Sat, 22 Oct 2022 12:26:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Translating in ADOBE using ADOBE PRO
Poster: Joakim Braun
Post title: What

What is "ADOBE Pro"?

If this refers to Adobe Acrobat Pro, it would be a terrible tool for translation. The editing functions are only intended for quick fixes of typos, printing-related technical errors and the like. The extra time required entirely depends on how many different fields the 100-200 words are located in and how much tinkering is required to make the copy fit the space.

[quote]
These are original files so they can be edited in ADOBE.
[/quote]

What does "original files" mean? PDF files? PDFs are never original files, they're always created from other editable formats (Indesign, Illustrator, Word etc). In that case you should be translating Indesign/Illustrator/Word files, which are CAT friendly. In the case of technical drawings the originating application might be some more arcane CAD software.

Several CAT tools can work with PDF, but the results would vary wildly from perfect to unusable, depending on the PDF structure and the relative text length of the translation.

Translating in ADOBE using ADOBE PRO

zaczac84 — Fri, 21 Oct 2022 15:38:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Translating in ADOBE using ADOBE PRO
Poster: zaczac84

Hi,

We have a project to translate 200 technical drawings from English into Spanish. These are original files so they can be edited in ADOBE. However, it is taking extremely long to edit using ADOBE Pro. Has anyone had experience with this and any ideas for a faster way to translate?

I am also curious that if I do use ADOBE Pro, how much more time should I budget than a standard translation on a WORD document. Keep in mind these files have only 100-200 words on them.

MT

Does it make sense for me training in DTP? | Why not

Philippe Locquet — Sat, 18 Jun 2022 14:20:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Does it make sense for me training in DTP?
Poster: Philippe Locquet
Post title: Why not

Other areas where it may be useful:
_For you direct customers, there's always a need to resize neatly due to language expansion.
_If you'd like to be hired as an in-house DTP specialist in a translation agency. Some offer the full process to their customers.

Does it make sense for me training in DTP? | Affinity

Joakim Braun — Fri, 17 Jun 2022 19:10:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Does it make sense for me training in DTP?
Poster: Joakim Braun
Post title: Affinity

[quote]Jorge Rodríguez Rodríguez wrote:

I have wondered to self-teach InDesign myself but I used the app several years ago before starting my career as a freelance translator and it is not that easy, although I am young and I am quite tech-savvy.
[/quote]

Adobe nowadays is subscription-only, and having a complete set of DTP tools available (less won't do for professional print work) is expensive enough to be annoying unless you use it regularly.

Have a look at the Affinity apps, though. They're quirky but impressive. Anything you learn there can be put to good use in Indesign.

Does it make sense for me training in DTP? | And only DTP?

Jorge Rodríguez Rodríguez — Fri, 17 Jun 2022 15:13:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Does it make sense for me training in DTP?
Poster: Jorge Rodríguez Rodríguez
Post title: And only DTP?

[quote]Kay Denney wrote:

If you're interested in doing that, why not, but I'm not sure that anyone will ask you to provide such services alongside translation.

Clients do need DTP for technical translations such as handbooks and instructions. The layout may not be as fancy or colourful as in marketing, but it needs to be clear, with legends obviously describing pie charts etc.

However, the client will mostly already have someone to do such work for them, they'll have worked on the source text before even thinking about having it translated.
It then makes sense for the same person to clean up your translation should the layout not fit perfectly (when your translation doesn't fit in the box that the source text was in).

The agency I worked at tried offering DTP as well as translation and they had to practically bully a long-time, well-paying client into agreeing to them doing it rather than their usual guy. I won't say any more, except that it was the last job we did for that client, and that client has since reached out to me as a freelancer, so it wasn't a problem with my translation.

I get the impression that clients will just say "oh you have InDesign? oh that's cool, I don't need to send a pdf then" and will expect you to simply make sure your translation doesn't mess up the layout, but without paying any extra. After all, nobody has ever paid us to stick to the same layout in Word, have they? [/quote]

I have just come across with the website of a translation agency based in UK and they offer DTP services to their clients. I am wondering if they may have a database for DTP experts, as well as translators or interpreters, and ask you for doing only DTP in a translation done for another person.

I was not thinking of offering translation+DTP but being requested doing DTP in some cases as another type of task.

I am not sure about what to do. I would like to be able to use InDesign well and any other tool related to those kinds of jobs, but, to be honest, I have specific training in Software, Mobile Apps and Video Games localization but I have done only 1 job in that field. I heard once, and I completely agree, that the areas of expertise choose the translator in many cases and not vice versa and I am afraid of spending more money to learn to use a tool and never need it.

I have wondered to self-teach InDesign myself but I used the app several years ago before starting my career as a freelance translator and it is not that easy, although I am young and I am quite tech-savvy.

I will have to give it quite more thought to decide.

Thank you.

[Edited at 2022-06-17 15:14 GMT]

Does it make sense for me training in DTP? | .

Kay Denney — Fri, 17 Jun 2022 13:06:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Does it make sense for me training in DTP?
Poster: Kay Denney
Post title: .

If you're interested in doing that, why not, but I'm not sure that anyone will ask you to provide such services alongside translation.

Clients do need DTP for technical translations such as handbooks and instructions. The layout may not be as fancy or colourful as in marketing, but it needs to be clear, with legends obviously describing pie charts etc.

However, the client will mostly already have someone to do such work for them, they'll have worked on the source text before even thinking about having it translated.
It then makes sense for the same person to clean up your translation should the layout not fit perfectly (when your translation doesn't fit in the box that the source text was in).

The agency I worked at tried offering DTP as well as translation and they had to practically bully a long-time, well-paying client into agreeing to them doing it rather than their usual guy. I won't say any more, except that it was the last job we did for that client, and that client has since reached out to me as a freelancer, so it wasn't a problem with my translation.

I get the impression that clients will just say "oh you have InDesign? oh that's cool, I don't need to send a pdf then" and will expect you to simply make sure your translation doesn't mess up the layout, but without paying any extra. After all, nobody has ever paid us to stick to the same layout in Word, have they?

Does it make sense for me training in DTP? | Maybe

Joakim Braun — Fri, 17 Jun 2022 12:12:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Does it make sense for me training in DTP?
Poster: Joakim Braun
Post title: Maybe

I'm a professional print designer and a sworn translator, spending about equal time in both areas.

Over 20 years, the crossover between those two areas has been zero.

Translation jobs involving Indesign (layout) files are always translated using CAT tools. The end customer will usually be an international company with annual reports or marketing material in several languages. They will usually outsource logistics to a PR agency, and the agency will then hire a translation agency for all their translation needs, and use in-house or freelance designers.

And as a translator, you'll never get to talk directly to the PR agency.
So that "hey, suppose I handle the DTP for you too" situation never materializes...

With smaller direct customers it could happen, but I haven't seen it.

I'd very much encourage you to learn DTP, but doing work efficiently requires knowing the applications quite well and having regular practise. Using Indesign three times a year will be slow going.

Does it make sense for me training in DTP?

Jorge Rodríguez Rodríguez — Fri, 17 Jun 2022 11:51:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Does it make sense for me training in DTP?
Poster: Jorge Rodríguez Rodríguez

Hello colleagues,

I am very interested in training to add DTP to my range of services.

However, I have got a question. Does it make sense for a technical translator to offer DTP services? I mean, I guess that you can offer DTP services for a translation done for any other colleague about any other field, but I think that DTP is more useful for marketing, advertising, brochures and literary texts.

Thank you for your comments.

Jorge

Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others | All CafeTran or any other CAT can do is preserve what there is

Artem Vakhitov — Wed, 24 Nov 2021 21:37:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others
Poster: Artem Vakhitov
Post title: All CafeTran or any other CAT can do is preserve what there is

Tom, I'm afraid that the success you've had with CafeTran in that respect is mostly due to your language pair. CafeTran may do the best job preserving the fonts for you, but it can't do anything about stuff that is not in the file being translated and not on your PC, like the Cyrillic part of the font (which may not even exist). For Russian, the font situation really sucks. I did a handful of jobs that required messing with fonts but now avoid them.

[quote]Tom in London wrote:

I don't know if this applies to all CAT tools, but one of the miracles of CafeTran is that when I drag and drop a .docx file on to the application and translate it, the exported file is in the same font as the original document ***even if I don't have that font on my computer***.

I don't know how this happens but it's one of the many positive things I have to say about CafeTran. Does the same thing happen with other CAT tools?

[Edited at 2021-11-21 09:38 GMT] [/quote]

[Edited at 2021-11-24 21:38 GMT]

Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others | Don't approximate

Joakim Braun — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 20:05:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others
Poster: Joakim Braun
Post title: Don't approximate

(Professional designer speaking here:)

Indesign files should be "packaged", so that fonts and linked images are included. Then you can open them locally in Indesign and things will look right. Translation agencies and their customers usually don't bother with this.
If you don't have EXACTLY the same fonts, you can't trust what you see onscreen.

Don't EVER touch ANYTHING in an Indesign file that you expect to deliver to a customer, unless you know what you're doing.

Don't spend time trying to find substitute fonts. Professionally designed documents often use commercial fonts costing hundreds of dollars which aren't readily available in pirated versions. Sometimes designers make their own custom versions of commercial fonts with special characters or kerning. NEVER change the fonts to "looks OK, doesn't it" substitutes and then deliver the file (or expect things to look as they do on your own screen).

It's common for high-end publications to use fonts from small foundries. There's no one font service that will give access to "all" fonts (even if it was affordable).

Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others | Thanks

Tom in London — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 09:56:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others
Poster: Tom in London
Post title: Thanks

Interesting

Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others | Not CAT specific

Philippe Locquet — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 09:48:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others
Poster: Philippe Locquet
Post title: Not CAT specific

[quote]Tom in London wrote:

I don't know if this applies to all CAT tools, but one of the miracles of CafeTran is that when I drag and drop a .docx file on to the application and translate it, the exported file is in the same font as the original document ***even if I don't have that font on my computer***.

I don't know how this happens but it's one of the many positive things I have to say about CafeTran. Does the same thing happen with other CAT tools?

[Edited at 2021-11-21 09:38 GMT] [/quote]

All the information from the original file is stored in CATs (in the xliff) in order to reconstruct the target file the exact same way it was as a source file.

A simple example to test that is:
_You get a source idml and open it on your computer, you get the message listing the missing fonts by name, take note of these.
_translate the file and get the target file
_open the translated idml, you should get a message listing the exact same missing fonts

The only situation where this does not happen is when your target language is CJK etc. where the fonts in source and target can't be the same for obvious reasons.

Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others | Miraculous CaeTran behaviour

Tom in London — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 09:38:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others
Poster: Tom in London
Post title: Miraculous CaeTran behaviour

I don't know if this applies to all CAT tools, but one of the miracles of CafeTran is that when I drag and drop a .docx file on to the application and translate it, the exported file is in the same font as the original document ***even if I don't have that font on my computer***.

I don't know how this happens but it's one of the many positive things I have to say about CafeTran. Does the same thing happen with other CAT tools?

[Edited at 2021-11-21 09:38 GMT]

Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others | Fonts are never identical

Multiverse Solutions s.r.o. (X) — Sat, 20 Nov 2021 22:13:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others
Poster: Multiverse Solutions s.r.o. (X)
Post title: Fonts are never identical

Each font has its own characteristics, including spacing between letters, distance between to next line text, itc. These all have sometimes fancy industry names. One of the most important is kerning, or alignment / adjustments of the neighbouring characters - which sometimes is tricky and may be rather impossible to duplicate.

Plus the font as a set of characters has a specific character size. 12 pt Times differs from 12 pt Calibri or 12 pt Arial in height.
Freeware designers do not necessarily follow industry guidelines, so so called replacements may make a mess instead of faithful reproduction.

There are too many factors to verify on the spot, so the "it looks kinda similar" approach is not what you want for InDesign publications (whether for online use of, the more so, for print).
Also, same-name fonts (Garamond, Times, ...) from different producers have different design properties and ARE different.

Thus, if the client values professional work, you will always need the original fonts that were used to generate the file.
If translator's work is only for review purposes, any font may be used as a temporary substitute because, most probably, your translation will be sent back to the designers of the original file.

Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others | The client needs to provide you with licensed fonts

Endre Both — Sat, 20 Nov 2021 14:56:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others
Poster: Endre Both
Post title: The client needs to provide you with licensed fonts

[quote]Philippe Locquet wrote:
you need to install the CC app and start syncing the fonts you want to use. Since they are synced, the day you stop your subscriptions, said fonts will go away [/quote]

To edit InDesign files, you'll need a CC subscription anyway, no? And if a client wants you to use fonts that are not available to you (via CC or otherwise), the onus is on them to provide you with a (temporary) license.

Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others | Free fonts

John Fossey — Fri, 19 Nov 2021 19:37:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others
Poster: John Fossey
Post title: Free fonts

This comes up from time to time, most recently a week ago. I was missing 2 fonts on my computer. I googled the font names and found one of them available free, I forget which website, but google will know. Double clicking the font file, after saving to my computer, installed the font.

The other font missing was an Adobe proprietary font, for which they wanted something like $50, so I ignored it. I couldn't tell any difference in the final file with the missing font.

Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others

Philippe Locquet — Fri, 19 Nov 2021 18:07:00 +0000

Forum: DTP - Desktop Publishing
Topic: Fonts not on computer (proprietary or not) from Adobe and others
Poster: Philippe Locquet

Hi all,
I was looking into this topic today and it seems there is nothing in the forums about this. If you have some input on this topic please add it!
If when translating you’re dealing only with xliff this will probably not be an issue to you.

But if you translate source files like idml etc. you may want to open the translated file to see how it looks or fix some issues if you’re dealing with the final client. If the fonts used to create the source file are not on your computer, you will have to use a different font to open the document. Since fonts can use more or less space you may end up looking at text that fits well when with the original font it won’t and vice-versa.
There is a zillion fonts available out there, many are free. If you know good free sites for fonts, please add them. Here’s one: [url removed]
About proprietary fonts:
These off-course are not free. Looking at the Adobe Creative Cloud ecosystem, I realized that many fonts are actually third-party fonts. I tested that with a font called “Jupiter” found on the Abobe CC. Getting more informations about that font I found that it’s been created by “Buro Destruct” (BD). They have their own website where they sell these but it’s also sold on a different font marketplace too: [url removed] and I’m sure there are more places like this to get fonts, please share which ones you know!

Having to toil to get these fonts handpicking them for our needs can take some time, and fonts don’t come cheap. For those having active subscriptions to creator’s software suites, that’s included in the package. But, even this way, these fonts are a “rental”: unless I’m mistaken, to get Adobe fonts on your computer, you need to install the CC app and start syncing the fonts you want to use. Since they are synced, the day you stop your subscriptions, said fonts will go away.
Not easy…

If you have useful tips/website correspondence list between proprietary and free fonts (for the space they occupy) etc. please share!
My bests to all 😊